Author Topic: Engine Price (Read 3861 times)

1969deluxebus · « **on:** February 02, 2004, 08:37:00 PM »

i haev never built or rebuilt an aircooled engine so seeing that i never had to pay for one to be rebuild either or new
my question is . How much would it cost a guy to build a nice 1776 or a 2110 and i know thsi is very broad but it has to be reliable so it can't be two crazy even thou i woudl love it it woudl be going in a bus that is driven daily. i am also willing to take suggestions on motors. I think it may be getting time i retire the single port work hourse for a while and feel what an engien with a bit of nuts feels like in the old bus. I want to go with webers i think and a 110 cam and i know heads are where it is at. I have asked this q to people but shops just say well it depends i know that. I am talking a good combo i just want a nice combo that is well proven to be great and woudl treat me well. So if anyone wants to give there two cents to this question giver it would help alot. thanks for your time much abliged.

Matt Street

Hansk · « **Reply #1 on:** February 02, 2004, 09:26:27 PM »

Well , ..A friend of mine built his stock 1600 dp into a 1914cc (69x94) with 110 cam &gear , rocker shaft kit, hi rev springs, deep sump , rebuilt heads , bearings , machining , etc. etc. About $1000. in parts alone. He and I did all the work . He already had carbs and header. He's very happy with it.
I would think it could cost another $1000 to have a shop do it for you.

mikeT · « **Reply #2 on:** February 03, 2004, 01:08:44 AM »

i had my 1776 built and it was about $2000, parts add up quickly, depends on what you use or want!

Stephan Schmidt · « **Reply #3 on:** February 03, 2004, 08:58:28 AM »

sometimes you can find nice turnkey motors in the buysell for cheap. not too long ago there were a few 2L motors in there without carbs for about $2000-3000. a good person to ask would be Geoff. he might know of a few motors that people have that are of no use to them, and require little to get running.

A 2110 requires quite a bit of machining. you could run a 1776 or a 1914 and get some really nice heads, thus saving the money on machining and putting the $$ into your heads. I'm going to be building a motor myself, and I'm in the same sitution as you. Pricing all differs in what you want. also, what type of driving will you be doing? with daily driving you might just want a simple 1776. they are quick little motors, and VERY reliable if built to meet your needs.

I'm thinking a complete NEW 1776 would cost you about $2000-2500 depending on parts used.

Stephan

1969deluxebus · « **Reply #4 on:** February 03, 2004, 12:01:33 PM »

well i would be driviing it all the time so the mpg can't be to far out the roof but i do want to have lots of juice i know it is all in the carbs and heads and that si where most of the money will go unless i get into machining and cranks. a 1914 was on my mined to The dream that I want to make real is an engine that doesn't have to rev high to get power and has at least 90hp and well cost around 1500-2500 give or take a very bucks. I am not about cutting corners when building it for i know you always build it right the first time and you build it to last. there are alot of combos out there hat i never see in peoples cars that i wonder where stand.
Another thing is i see alot of 1776 around and they are priced around 5-6 hundard with out carbs,tin, and etc. the thing with those is you don't knwo what is in it unless you know the guy.
a 1914 head pumps out a lot of hp but it just eats the gas because of the hig reving . This is not a fact it is just word of mouth so if anyone knwos diffent they can tell me that woudl be good. and also are 1914 cheaper to build.
thanks for your tie and help
Matt Street

James Buchan · « **Reply #5 on:** February 03, 2004, 12:38:54 PM »

Your kinda right about the high revving engine scenario. My 1915 has it's power up high compared to a stroker engine.

Typically in a bus a person would run a larger crank/smaller p/c set. Gives you more torque for pushing the breadbox right.

I'd say shoot for a 74/90.5 combo which is a 1904 ( 74 by most accounts is a drop in crank so you would save on machining)
Ideally talk to the person you will have build the engine - they will be your best resource.

There are a few people around that have had good success with this combo.

Stephan Schmidt · « **Reply #6 on:** February 03, 2004, 12:39:22 PM »

1776 and 1914 cost about the same amount to build. the only difference is the piston and cylinder size. it uses the same crank, and everything else. a stock 1914 head (which is probably just a factory 1600 head) will not put out more horsepower than a 1776 or 1600 head, unless its modified.

with fuel consumption, it depends a lot of compression, type of driving, heads, and carbs.

for you and what you are looking for I'd suggest the following (commonly used in buses)

1776 (90.5x69)
69mm counterweight crank
40x35.5 heads
engle 110 cam
lightened flywheel
factory balanced rods
90.5 cima P&C
40mm webbers
7.5:1 compression
full flow, etc...

you can always drop in a larger crank if you want to which will give you more torque at lower RPM's

this would give a safe 90-100 horsepower.
this combo is also well within $2500 if built right.

Bruce · « **Reply #7 on:** February 03, 2004, 02:31:32 PM »

I agree with the combo Staphan suggests, except use a stock flywheel in a Bus.

If you want to step up from there, a 78 stroke crank is next. While a 74 stroke crank sounds economical due to the fact that you \"may\" not need to clearance the case, they actually take way more time to build because nothing fits right. The stroker pistons with a 78-82 crank come out to a stock width engine, and everything fits (exhaust, head studs, pushrods, pushrod tubes, cylinder tin, fan shrouds, carb linkage) Build a 74 stroke engine with non-stroker pistons and it ends up too wide. Use stroker pistons and you get too much deck height and have to custom machine the cylinders shorter. Then everything is too long to fit properly.

1969deluxebus · « **Reply #8 on:** February 04, 2004, 02:24:21 AM »

that would make it a 2007 ? the bus is just a kombi meaning passenger so it is lighter then a camper and i don't think i would lighten the flywheel unles it would help. 90-100 is a good hp range i just want to be able to have a bit moe power on the highway and and for thos times i feel like having fun with other buses at the line. right now i am getting wiped. i can say i don't want speed but hey we all liek it some times. it is a bus i know it is not made to be a pony eater. would i ahev to worry about clutch /pressure plate with a 1776/1914/2110 if i am around 90-100
and would webers or dells be better to go with and what size would be best persay
and should the heads 40x37.5, 42x37.5,44x37.5 what would be best for an engine that woudl fit my need. like i said it is a daily driver and needs to be reliable , but also need to be nice . i know heads are a big thing when it comes to building an engine. i already know that 110 is the cam. thanks much for your time
Matt Street

Stephan Schmidt · « **Reply #9 on:** February 04, 2004, 08:30:51 AM »

it sounds like you...don't have a lot of money, and then you do have a lot of money. Do you want High horsepower, or a good daily driver with more power (90-100 HP).

what I suggested will give you a lot more power than a factory 1600, it will be reliable, cheap, and you'll be happy with then end result.

if you wnt to go 2110, then you are looking at a bare case machined for about $500-$600, then a crank $400, P&C $400, carbs $600, Heads $600-700, then labour, cam, header, exhaust, tin, alternator, oiling, etc... you bill would be in the $4000+ dollar range if you want to build it right the first time like you said.

these are just rough estimates. I think that the crank will be a lot more, and the heads depending on what you want, will be more as well.

like I said, if you are looking for a daily driver and don't want to spend too much but get more power, a 1776 with the specs above will be prefect.

Stephan

Bruce · « **Reply #10 on:** February 04, 2004, 12:14:02 PM »

To build a stump puller 2 liter, you need 40x35 heads, no bigger. Airspeed has a special on genuine VW castings with those valves already installed. Then get them ported by Darren K.
Use 40mm Webers or 40 Dellortos.

1969deluxebus · « **Reply #11 on:** February 04, 2004, 05:21:16 PM »

from all these replys it seems like my engine is coming together. i found a full exaust system with fat boy for 200 flanged with everything ceramic. is that a god exaust for that kinda engine it is just a standard set up not merged. it would suck to build a nice engine like this and not let it breath. would bigger heads be to big of head for an engine that size? what about rockers ?
matt street

Stephan Schmidt · « **Reply #12 on:** February 04, 2004, 05:27:39 PM »

Quote

from all these replys it seems like my engine is coming together. i found a full exaust system with fat boy for 200 flanged with everything ceramic. is that a god exaust for that kinda engine it is just a standard set up not merged. it would suck to build a nice engine like this and not let it breath. would bigger heads be to big of head for an engine that size? what about rockers ?
matt street

if you want a little more top end (forget the torque that you want for the bus)

44 IDF webbers ($600)
42x37.5 ported and polished (will cost you about $1200 for a really good P&P job)
1.25:1 ratio rockers

I'd stick with the 40mm. remember, you want a daily driver thats good on gas too. trust me, these motors add up to a lot more in the end.

my 356 motor with IDA's cost a lot in the end than I had originally planned. the budget was $3500 it ended up around $5000

Stephan

notchback · « **Reply #13 on:** February 06, 2004, 06:31:32 PM »

you can't run a merged exhaust on your bus because of the engine hanger , it gets in the way. I tried to make something work but it would take making a header from scratch. Stick to a smaller engine with that smaller header. 1776 or 1914

1969deluxebus · « **Reply #14 on:** February 12, 2004, 06:42:23 PM »

should i go 7:5:1 i talked to dave at abby country and he said to high for a bus???
Matt Street

James Buchan · « **Reply #15 on:** February 12, 2004, 06:46:54 PM »

STAY AWAY FROM DAVE AT ABBY COUNTRY LIKE THE PLAGUE - HE IS A CROOK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (imo)

Yes I was yelling the above at you incase you didn't hear me!

1969deluxebus · « **Reply #16 on:** March 06, 2004, 04:43:59 PM »

i was just searching to day and i came across this what is peeps two cents? I know it is cip
http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?Pr...Code=C15%2D1776
mattstreet

Scratchy · « **Reply #17 on:** March 06, 2004, 08:12:20 PM »

Man you got BIG kahunas to post that on AirSpeed's forum.

And YOU want help from these guys? :wacko:

Well here you go:

Cast cranks are TOTAL crap.
Don't bring that weak a$$ed sh1t around here. Even a stock crank is forged,
why would you take a step backwards and use a cast crank? A well built welded, forged counterweighted crank is far superior.

Shane · « **Reply #18 on:** March 07, 2004, 08:54:42 AM »

What i dont get is ...........
Airspeed can help you with all your engine needs... THen you post something from CIP.
Why dont you go into the CIP store and look at all thier product first hand? Oh cuz you cant! Hmmm
Why dont you go talk to the knowledgable owners of CIP and ask them how they would build an engine?
Oh cuz you cant. To see the owners would be amazing.... NEWS FLASH..... You can do this at Airspeed.!!!!
These guys Live and Breathe VW's. They want you to have the best most reliable cars in town.... Best of all there Knowledge is free!!!!! Should stop in and see them sometime...

my .02

ehos · « **Reply #19 on:** March 07, 2004, 12:31:09 PM »

Also,

Cip carries GEX engines. (Their part numbers even say \"GEX\" so that should tell you something).

Oh, if you don't know, GEX sucks. It's fluff and buff. I think that short block these guys are offering is pretty good deal for 1000!! (Stroker shorty for 1000, that's pretty cheap).

Put some P&C, heads, and you're almost done. New case, new everything. Old cases suck too

And don't buy used parts off of ebay

Actually, don't buy used parts for engines (VW's) unless you see the guy run the engine, and he takes it off right here.

I still wonder why people buy carbs off of ebay. MAN! What a crapshoot, for the 100-200 you MIGHT save, get the real deal (unless it some crazy deal).

Anyways, sorry for the rant. Just hate seeing people waste time/money on junk stuff.

1969deluxebus · « **Reply #20 on:** March 07, 2004, 03:20:35 PM »

well i was thinking i would get this flack i was just useing it as an example i buy mostly all my parts from airspeed un less i am stuck i know they will match mostly any competor where it is vaild they are not a big box show so they have more over head. Any way i just wanted to know about the engine i woudl get it from airspeed if i was to get it i am just testing teh waters.
Matt Street

Author Topic: Engine Price (Read 3861 times)

Stephan Schmidt

Stephan Schmidt

Stephan Schmidt

Stephan Schmidt